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| Juest | hey blast007, i have a few ideas/suggestions for the game and i was wondering about feasibility of it and where it stands in the possible roadmap | 14:56 |
|---|---|---|
| Juest | not a priority of course | 14:56 |
| Juest | but | 14:56 |
| Juest | 1) custom cameras set by the map replacing the first person camera for like racing or scenic gameplay | 14:57 |
| Juest | 2) make autopilot a bad flag and make it inaccessible via a keybind on demand, also is there even a setting to allow/disallow autopilot already? | 14:58 |
| Juest | 3) possible to fork/daemonize bzfs? | 14:59 |
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| blast007 | what do you mean by daemonize? | 15:57 |
| blast007 | run it in the background? | 15:57 |
| blast007 | cuz you already can | 15:57 |
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| blast007 | custom camera would be a bit confusing if that was for people playing | 16:04 |
| blast007 | and yes, there is _disableRobots that affects autopilot as well | 16:04 |
| blast007 | last I messed with it, the client would accept a MsgAutopilot for itself. I had an April Fools prank server that would automatically spawn players and force autopilot on (among other things like always spawning players facing a corner, and spawning everyone as a rabbit on an FFA server) | 16:06 |
| blast007 | were you thinking of observer mode for the custom cameras? | 16:08 |
| blast007 | That could make sense. You'd need to add something to the world format so that would require a protocol break. | 16:09 |
| Juest | oh, bzfs already can fork and run in the background? | 17:54 |
| Juest | yes, for people playing, the controls would remain the same, its for like top down experiences where the camera is anchored and moving with the tank | 17:54 |
| Juest | for observer mode maybe replace the chase camera with the "cinematic" camera, as other racing games may have | 17:56 |
| Juest | so it would be on the world format side of things? or a plugin? | 17:56 |
| Juest | how about autopilot as a bad flag? | 18:00 |
| blast007 | Juest: *any* process can run in the background | 18:08 |
| blast007 | bzfs & | 18:08 |
| blast007 | bam, now you have bzfs running in the background | 18:08 |
| blast007 | I go with a script that effectively do that, but also loops and writes out a PID file | 18:09 |
| blast007 | https://static.bzexcess.com/runserver.sh | 18:10 |
| blast007 | (my config also loads a shared config, and that other config loads serverControl which will watch for some filenames to know to shut down a server) | 18:11 |
| Juest | blast007: that's not proper daemon fork() its just shell jobs in the background in a tty | 18:12 |
| blast007 | what possible benefit would that have? | 18:48 |
| Juest | servers and embedded | 19:41 |
| Juest | not bothering the user | 19:41 |
| blast007 | but what is the actual benefit? | 20:23 |
| * Juest sighs | 20:28 | |
| Juest | sorry for the suggestion then | 20:28 |
| blast007 | you can run bzfs via systemd already, and systemd even supports template unit files, so you can run multiple instances | 20:31 |
| Juest | how about unprivileged users with no user services? | 20:32 |
| blast007 | I had experimented with that a bit. You could have a standard directory structure for your servers, such as organizing them by port number. Then you have a systemd unit named something like bzflag-server@.service, and you can create multiple instances of that. Inside the systemd unit you can reference the instance identified with %i. | 20:33 |
| blast007 | you could create a service account that bzfs runs out of | 20:34 |
| Juest | i guess but im not talking about systemd systems, i get its a minority but its a thing | 20:35 |
| blast007 | you're talking about how to run bzfs | 20:35 |
| blast007 | that's one of the many ways to do it | 20:36 |
| Juest | true | 20:36 |
| blast007 | from running GNU screen and having an instance per window, to background processes, to systemd templates, they all work fine | 20:36 |
| Juest | fork() could be just another option in the arsenal :) plus built in pid file management | 20:37 |
| Juest | see znc for instance | 20:37 |
| blast007 | what would fork() do differently? | 20:37 |
| blast007 | you just keep referring to it, but not explaining the "why" | 20:37 |
| Juest | you're aware what it does, right? | 20:37 |
| Juest | i am not good at explaining in detail and particularly why | 20:38 |
| Juest | particularly explaining why* | 20:38 |
| Juest | hmm, it could be possible to use fork() to spawn a farm of server configurations in a single box in a more automated manner | 20:39 |
| blast007 | how is that better than systemd template units? | 20:40 |
| Juest | that would involve a configuration hierarchy system for bzfs to learn/know what to load | 20:40 |
| Juest | the bzfs main process would manage them and restart if necessary | 20:41 |
| Juest | just an option for users who may not know or like systemd template system | 20:41 |
| Juest | it would have made more sense to implement if we were in the sysvinit era | 20:42 |
| Juest | basically 10+ years ago | 20:42 |
| Juest | 15* | 20:42 |
| Juest | im thinking, about doing custom cameras in bzf, novel thing i know, maybe a plugin might be more suitable for this but doing it in the world would be the option with less overhead at the cost of compatibility | 20:44 |
| blast007 | plugin couldn't do it | 20:45 |
| Juest | and outside the api? | 20:45 |
| blast007 | I mean it would require client modifications too | 20:52 |
| blast007 | and protocol changes | 20:52 |
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| BulletCatcher | I agree with blast007 that a self-daemonizing option for bzfs has little (if any) value. Any server management system we would invent would be just as difficult for someone to learn to use as systemd or anything else, so they might as well learn somthing that may be useful in another context. | 23:54 |
| BulletCatcher | Even if we were to invent something that meets Juest's needs, it probably wouldn't meet the specific needs of anyone else. | 23:57 |
| BulletCatcher | When I ran a server I wrote some scripts to automate the whole thing, but it was complicated and I wouldn't want to have to teach anyone else how to use it. | 23:59 |
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