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| BZNotify | feature/container @ bzflag: blast007 pushed 1 commit (https://github.com/BZFlag-Dev/bzflag/compare/a3cd157cc8d9...730c0479c76c): | 11:34 |
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| BZNotify | feature/container @ bzflag: blast007 730c04: Add information about automatically starting Podman containers (https://github.com/BZFlag-Dev/bzflag/commit/730c0479c76ca68a64ab4b780728a45ed96f6c3e) | 11:34 |
| BZNotify | bzflag: blast007 synchronized pull request #339 "Add official Dockerfile to the project" by allejo (https://github.com/BZFlag-Dev/bzflag/pull/339) | 11:34 |
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| bz-next | I have to take a moment to plug the Magnum graphics library, the developer is extremely responsive and helpful. I've never seen this level of support for an open source library before. Companies pay big bucks for way worse support. | 17:03 |
| bz-next | I don't think I've ever waited more than a day to have some question answered, and often it's instant | 17:22 |
| bz-next | And by an actual domain expert, too! | 17:22 |
| blast007 | mmmmm, Valve just released their Steam Audio codebase under the Apache 2.0 license. | 17:51 |
| blast007 | https://valvesoftware.github.io/steam-audio/ https://github.com/ValveSoftware/steam-audio https://steamcommunity.com/app/596420/eventcomments/4361243264663731579?snr=2_groupannouncements_detail_ | 17:52 |
| blast007 | and it supports Windows, Linux, macOS, Android, and iOS | 17:53 |
| bz-next | yay it has a plain C api | 17:54 |
| bz-next | that could be cool to try pulling in | 17:55 |
| blast007 | I hope that "Realtime Sound Propagation" means it takes the speed of sound into account to delay when a sound reaches you, because that would be one improvement over OpenAL | 17:56 |
| bz-next | openAL is what is used currently? | 17:57 |
| blast007 | nope, our audio code is fully custom | 18:01 |
| bz-next | from playing it seems to try to do audio delay, direction and even some sort of doppler thing sometimes? | 18:02 |
| blast007 | yup | 18:02 |
| blast007 | it treats each ear separately for the sound propagation | 18:03 |
| blast007 | and the wave propagates out from the sound source, so you won't hear it until the wave has reached you. Also, in the unlikely event that you respawn or teleport further way, it's possible to hear the same sound twice, since it doesn't remove the audio source until it has left the world area. | 18:04 |
| bz-next | ah yeah I have noticed that before | 18:06 |
| bz-next | it'd be cool if you could download map geometry into this steam thing and it'd magically make it all work better | 18:06 |
| blast007 | guess I should say in the unlikely even that you heard a sound and THEN teleport/respawn further way before it has reached that new location... | 18:06 |
| blast007 | event* | 18:06 |
| blast007 | away* | 18:06 |
| bz-next | I find it hard to distinguish direction in the current system, especially front/back, but some players have gotten good at it... | 18:07 |
| blast007 | I had a previous attempt at switching it over to OpenAL: https://github.com/BZFlag-Dev/bzflag/pull/158 | 18:07 |
| bz-next | did it help with spatialization | 18:07 |
| blast007 | no idea | 18:08 |
| blast007 | I hadn't tested it that much | 18:08 |
| blast007 | at the time, the motivation was to fix the popping sound that we had in BZFlag's audio code. The difference in how OpenAL handled the propagation complicated how I would need to integrate it. | 18:10 |
| bz-next | I'll pull the steam thing into my experiment so it'll be there once it's time to play with audio... | 18:13 |
| bz-next | maybe having the mesh data aggregated will make it easier to feed in | 18:13 |
| blast007 | I wonder how much complexity it handles | 18:15 |
| bz-next | why is the default release binary objects and includes whyyyy | 18:15 |
| blast007 | hmm? | 18:15 |
| bz-next | I was hoping it'd be source code I could just git submodule in | 18:15 |
| blast007 | oh, their stuff | 18:16 |
| bz-next | I can't imagine anyone happy with a distro that's a bunch of pre-built libraries and headers, since linking prebuilt stuff for multiple platforms sounds like a mess | 18:16 |
| bz-next | Just makes me wonder, who is that for, exactly? | 18:17 |
| blast007 | where are you seeing binaries? | 18:18 |
| bz-next | https://valvesoftware.github.io/steam-audio/downloads.html under C API | 18:18 |
| blast007 | https://github.com/ValveSoftware/steam-audio | 18:18 |
| bz-next | yeah... | 18:18 |
| blast007 | keep in mind that this *just* went open-source 19 hours ago | 18:19 |
| bz-next | also looks like no WASM support? | 18:22 |
| bz-next | I wonder if it would just work under WASM anyway | 18:23 |
| blast007 | https://github.com/ValveSoftware/steam-audio/issues/234 | 18:23 |
| bz-next | that looks promising in context | 18:24 |
| bz-next | thankfully it has internal tooling to pull all its deps in | 18:31 |
| bz-next | hopefully integrating it with cmake wouldn't be so bad... cmake scares me | 18:32 |
| bz-next | there is so much to be done to update this game | 18:36 |
| bz-next | audio, networking, graphics, pretty much every subsystem could benefit from getting plugged into modern libraries | 18:38 |
| bz-next | and personally I don't feel like a rewrite with a game engine would end up as the same game | 18:40 |
| bz-next | AFAIK the main open-source friendly engine would be Ogre and I don't know how it is to actually use | 18:41 |
| bz-next | and even in that case it's only graphics afaik | 18:43 |
| blast007 | I had compiled a list of possible engines/libraries back in 2016: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1xBUByF5D2-tmLe5NZW7yg5D5oUKwbaZkjKoN7PJ1dR4/edit?pli=1#heading=h.if9wbbnv37t2 | 18:45 |
| blast007 | https://github.com/SLikeSoft/SLikeNet <-- that's a fork of RakNet that *was* getting updates, but seems to not have been touched in 3 years. | 18:47 |
| bz-next | Would a dedicated networking lib tailored for games bring anything to the table over using regular networking tools? | 18:50 |
| bz-next | That's a good doc btw I'll have to study it a while | 18:50 |
| blast007 | there's also Entity Component Systems like flecs ( https://www.flecs.dev/flecs/ ) and EnTT ( https://github.com/skypjack/entt ) | 18:51 |
| bz-next | from what I know so far, I think you could integrate any of these with the magnum scenegraph using "features" which are abstract bits of data/functionality that can be attached to scenegraph objects | 18:53 |
| blast007 | another network library for games: https://github.com/mas-bandwidth/yojimbo | 18:55 |
| bz-next | I like the idea of pulling in new libs one by one and connecting them to the game because it might actually be humanly possible | 18:56 |
| blast007 | yeah | 18:57 |
| blast007 | replacing the networking with a library will itself be a major undertaking because of how spread out our handling of networking is | 18:57 |
| blast007 | same for everything else | 18:58 |
| blast007 | we have everything intermingled :) | 18:58 |
| bz-next | lol yeah... hopefully each step results in some general cleanup that makes later steps easier | 18:58 |
| bz-next | my plan is to do the absolute bare minimum so that it actually has a chance of getting done | 18:58 |
| bz-next | even then, it's like cutting through a jungle with a machete, there's so much that needs to be connected up again | 18:59 |
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| blast007 | hahaha, I think I just figured out why BZEditW32_1.6.5.exe has so many weekly downloads on SourceForge. winetricks uses it to source some Visual C++ 2003 DLL files. | 19:24 |
| blast007 | https://github.com/Winetricks/winetricks/blob/master/src/winetricks#L13082-L13112 | 19:24 |
| blast007 | that's been a mystery here since at least 2016 | 19:30 |
| blast007 | 2015* | 19:30 |
| blast007 | apparently we knew about that in 2008 even, since brlcad noticed it. | 19:47 |
| blast007 | <+DTRemenak> brlcad: yeah, Dan Kegel wanted a "small, free app that ships the vc7.1 runtimes" | 19:47 |
| blast007 | <+DTRemenak> so I suggested bzedit ;) | 19:48 |
| blast007 | I had just forgotten about that and then later wondered why bzedit saw thousands of downloads per month | 19:48 |
| bz-next | lmao what the heck | 19:54 |
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